Apache Pivot 1.4 vs. JavaFX, Flex, Silverlight, Swing

Question

I've recently heard about Apache Pivot being moved to the Top Level Projects category and I was wondering who has tried the most recent version and compared it to other RIA tools. What are the proper categories for comparison?

It seems to be easier to pick up for Java developers since JavaFX has a different scripting language. The Pivot developers say that Pivot is what Sun should have made instead of JavaFX.

Solution 1

I worked with Pivot and even been part of Pivot development. It is a nice little library, but...

It cannot replace Swing or JavaFX. The original authors are positioning it to compete with Adobe Flex. Because of that its concepts are more like applet than desktop application. It is almost impossible to create a modern desktop application simply because it has a concept of one main window and all the child windows are "inside" of it. I discussed this with authors but it looks like this is the way they want to go.

The library uses its own custom collections library which is sort of strange, but it isn't a show stopper.

Other then that the library is nice. But who is creating applets these days?

Solution 2

Good to hear from you. :-) I agree that we tend to focus more on applet deployment in Pivot's design. However, there is nothing inherent in the platform that prevents an application from using multiple top-level windows. It's just not something we cater to since it isn't relevant to our primary use case (which, as you noted, is browser deployment). Note that it is also not possible to create multiple top-level windows in Flex or Silverlight.

Re: "who is creating applets these days?" - it's not so much about creating applets as it is about creating RIAs. If you ask the question, "who is creating RIAs?", I think the answer would be "a lot of people". Pivot simply allows developers to build RIAs in Java (rather than ActionScript, for example).

Greg

Solution 3

Well, I checked pivot 1.4. You can have sub-windows.

Oracle/Sun is putting a lot of effort into promoting JavaFX but it seems to me that all the layout feature etc from swing are gone in profits to some multi-media stuff. Right now FX and business applications are two things very far from each other.

For business RIA application, my first impression is that Pivot is much better designed than FX.

Pivot provides a lot: binding, easy web service, nice design, xml definition of UI... - Yes a lot to consider for a Java developer.

Not perfect but looking at what they have accomplished these last 6 months... impressive!

Comments

[Augustus Thoo]

I concur with Greg. I was motivated to try Pivot after giving up on Swing development due to its high memory usage. Pivot offers a viable alternative to Swing, JavaFX and GWT.

[Unai Vivi]

+1 for what you explain in your "It cannot replace Swing or JavaFX" paragraph

[kbec]

And there is no workaround to have more than one top window? If mixtures of pivot and swing are possible (I hear that) then possibly it can be done? I'm just reading about pivot. I don't tried it yet.

[Eugene Ryzhikov]

Currently the best solution for Java Desktop (if you just starting) seems to be JavaFX. One of the Pivot authors is actually a member of JavaFX development team now.

[codingscientist]

If 'google trends' comparisons are used for choosing technology then any old name would always be chosen over new ones. JavaFx has been there for long time so it has more awareness. That does not necessarily mean it is better than Pivot.